The Joy (and Agony) of Skiing, Surfing, and Climbing in the Dead of Night, with Chris Benchetler

Chris Benchetler Ep Draft

[00:00:00]

Chris: I couldn't have created this without support. I'm very open and collaborative, but I would say that was closer to a band than anything. And the the dead are riffing off of each other and when everything's connected and in rhythm is when the magic happens. And my direction was so at a 30,000 foot view was so hard for them and so confusing. 'cause it wasn't like, here's our shot list, here's what we need.

It was like, here's this concept of what I tried to explain of honoring and supporting the Grateful Dead's legacy. Something that has shaped my life. Honoring mycology, honoring light, and the natural world, honoring all of these sports. Which is why I specifically chose

them for this film. the best of the best as the brush strokes for this canvas. And so Rob and Danny, and Michelle, and Elena and all these people that were, my brush strokes because this is, it could be looked at as a documentary of my mind and how I see the world, but it's not supposed to be just about me, it's

Paddy: [00:01:00] Well, yeah. how metaphoric that is, right? If,

you're talking about the mycelium network throughout the world, and what you're doing is you're like, here are the areas in which we're going to film. Go out there and do your thing. idea is now connected with them. Their creation on the landscape is now connected to you and then connected to the audience.

And so then boom, you've done it. the mycelium network is then fully realized in this creation.

Chris: a hundred percent. There we go.

Just pick up that mic and drop it on the floor. You've done it again. You're real good at this.

Paddy: MUSIC

PADDYO VO:

I like to think of myself as a bit of a dreamer. Coming up with creative ideas for work projects or who and how I talk to folks is my sweetspot. I also love to brainstorm outdoor pursuits. Maybe it's a quickhitter backcountry ski mission that'll get me some snowy wiggles and also get me back home in time [00:02:00] for diaper duty. Maybe it's a fun, mellow family jaunt in the woods that'll get my wife and I some smiles and some fitness before our daughter has to be home for her nap. Sometimes I dream up longterm goals like running a 40 mile ultra or a week-long hut trip. And when I can dream up a work thing that is also an outdoor thing, I feel like I've hit peak dreamer status.

But for as much as I workout and rely on my creativity biceps, there are plenty of ideas that I've talked myself out of. I'm sure you have too. Ya know, some armchair fantasy that is so audacious, so ambitious that you realize it's just too damn hard to make a reality and so you settle back into the comfort of the couch having never tried. But, what if you never ever gave up on your [00:03:00] super out there ideas? Well, then you'd probably be professional skier and artist Chris Benchetler.

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You may know Chris as the husband of snowbaording legend Kimmy Fasani. If you remember, last year we talked with Kimmy on the show about her film, Butterfly in a Blizzard, which documents Kimmy's battle with breast cancer over a 6 year period. Point is, as a family, Kimmy and Chris do the hard thing.

Chris is a legendary freesker and artist, and award winning filmmaker. He grew up in Mammoth Lakes, California, and says that being immersed in that landscape continues to shape his creative and athletic identity. Chris' work, which menas both his art and his skiing, is heavily influenced by his lifelong love affair with the music of the Grateful Dead, the mountains he spends his free time exploring, and the idea that art and movement are deeply interconnected.

And [00:04:00] so when he dreampt up an idea to combine the sports he loves with the music he loves with the mountains he loves with the art he loves in a neon explosion of glow in the dark trippy filmmaking, Chris figured...hell, what's so hard about that?

The film is called Mountains of the Moon and the best way I can describe it is as if a snowfilled mountain lived inside a lava lamp and then someone skied, climbed, biked, and surfed it. In order to pull off his vision, Chris had to convince a lot of sponsors, athletes, and filmmakers to lug generators, light and laser rigs, glow in the dark skeleton suits, safety equipment, plus thousands of pounds of camera equipment deep into the backcountry...in freezing temps. But they said yes, becuase this is no run of the mill action sports flick. It is a realization of Chris' creative [00:05:00] process and a representation of the world's mycology network, the underground structure created Earth's fungi that connects...well, everthing. Some folks call it the "Internet of Fungi." ... The Grateful Dead music helps with this...ahem...

If you're thinking, this is kinda out there...you're not wrong. Chris is kinda a out there dude. But what is grounding about the way the gears in his noodle work is that Chris will dream big, as big as it gets, but he'll never talk himself out of something becuase it seems too hard. And that is something I think all of us can learn from.

Now, hold onto your butts. We're about to blast into outerspace.

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First things first, burnt toast. What's your last humbling and or hilarious moment outside?

Chris: I have a humbling and a hilarious moment, so I am this isn't far outside. I'm sure we wanted something in the back country or deep, some crazy adventure. It [00:06:00] was November

at 2024 Thanksgiving time,

And I skateboard on a cruiser to go get a coffee. And

Paddy: Great.

Chris: so I'll backtrack, I'm headed the following week from here.

I'm flying to go scout where we're going to heli ski for my project I've been working on. So I'm going up to Wigglys. I have all my ski stuff down here. It's the first turns of the year I get to go heli skiing, get to go test. skateboarding to get a coffee, third push, um, like on my back foot, you know, I'm not pushing Mongo, you know, I learned that as a young child.

Can't do that. So pushing with my back foot, all my weights on my front foot. Third push on a cruiser, going quite fast. Hit a rock and just go flying

and fractured my hip in multiple places. And then,

Paddy: dude, I thought you were gonna be like, oh, and I spilled my coffee.

Chris: no, no, no, no, no. So, both funny, embarrassing and, and humbling. So I

was very embarrassed. 'cause there was people around, I jumped up and I [00:07:00] was like, oh my gosh. You know, felt, felt very old instantly. And I hurt my wrist too, actually. Um, and so I continued to skate because I hadn't even got the coffee at this point.

Um, I continued to skate to go meet who I was meeting. I was actually, you're, you're bringing in all my memory here. Um, I was going to meet my boss at GoPro to give me a camera for this shoot. And I get to coffee, explain why I am hobbling. I'm like, oh my gosh.

I just ate crap so hard.

Paddy: and also an ambulance if

Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then by the time we finished chatting and drinking our coffee, she had to gimme a ride home, which was less like a half a mile away from the coffee shop. and then, fast track to me going on the heli trip. I couldn't even click my binding into my, I I was so hurt.

And then, so when I got home from that heli trip, I was like, I better get this checked out. Got an MRI that would be my burnt toast moment. And

Paddy: is a very, very burned toast. [00:08:00] might be the most burn-ed of toast that we've had. Wow. Okay. I'm, I'm, I'm excited for this. Alright, get into it

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Do you have a favorite turn?

Chris: Yeah,

absolutely. Anytime there's a natural replication of a wave in, in the snow, like when there's that perfect wind lip, generally a right hander since I'm regular foot.

Paddy: Yeah,

Chris: So when I see a perfect righthander that just goes down the slope, then that's gets me excited for sure.

Paddy: Can you describe the moment and the feeling of it?

Chris: It is the type of turn that led me down the path that I've been on of ski technology and how a ski performs and turns like I guess the feeling that I always hope for and that I've had many times is maybe.

A lot of speed. So a good enough pitch and you, you start to engage your turn and you can draw it out, maybe drag a hand, get the tails [00:09:00] to release nicely in the turn. Sometimes taking it to switch or doing a butter out of it is another personal favorite of mine. But I think just that weight, that weightless feeling, and the faster you go, you can really just do a very enhanced, large carve.

And I love carving and slashing versus just, uh, you see a lot of people in powder. I'm guilty of it too. You just throw 'em sideways and kind of white room yourself. I mu I much more prefer a nice big floating arc that you feel like you're, uh, I'll use Rob Machado as an example since he's a dear friend

Paddy: Yeah, yeah,

Chris: my life, but feel like you're Rob Machado for a moment.

You

Paddy: Yeah,

Chris: just on a wave doing that big turn.

Paddy: You're kind of hitting me right in the heart and making me feel good because that kind of like right footer or slarve over a convex role I dream about it.

Because there's something about the floating feeling of it and snapping your tails back underneath and like continuing after like, you know, hanging this big [00:10:00] curtain

of snow that perhaps like your whole mustache face went through. It's such a great feeling and. It's something about the, the, the way it physically feels, but also something about like, how it just like hits me in the heart, like how it emotionally

feels. do you feel like there's a connection between the physicality of the turn and like your emotional, connection to it or reaction to it?

Chris: I would say yes. That's probably why I am still chasing this elusive, elusive white dragon of a turn. Yeah, no, I think I'll, it's very emotional and it's on a very deep level, and it's something that I've, I spent a lifetime looking for, so, yes.

Paddy: Is there something similar that you look for, like, the same kind of sweet spot when you're creating art?

Chris: Yes. Absolutely. I think, the best way to describe it as you're in pure presence without having to be a master monk or any type of meditative genius that spent your lifetime getting to that moment in time. it's [00:11:00] so overused, but. For a good reason. The flow state happens a lot when you're just in that pure presence and these things are moving through you and your actions are moving faster than your thought.

It's just pure instinct and intuition that's taking you into that moment,

and that happens a lot in my painting. That happens a lot in my skiing where it's just moving through you in a way that feels, so natural, and feels like everything's aligned for that moment in time.

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Paddy: I really want to mine this connection of art and skiing in you. And the reason I want to start here in our chat is that I, I myself certainly understand how creativity is present in my life, in the things that I do outside,

and also as a dude who is pulled to make stuff and make stuff for a living.

But I'm wondering about the place you seem to live in, which is almost a constant overlap. Of the two, it seems like.

and I [00:12:00] also think that whenever kind of, you know, discussing art or creativity or the, creative process, like it's pretty easy to go off the rails and into like, super heady descriptions.

So I'm hoping that we can stay in a little bit of a grounded place. So with that in mind, like

many

Chris: telling me I'm, you just used the word heady to one of the biggest Grateful Dead fans out there. Sorry.

No carry. Carry on. Carry on.

Paddy: I know, I know it was, well, we might start on the ground and, end, uh, you know, up, like, , by Mars, like pretty quickly

here, um, which is totally, totally cool. You go where you want to go buddy. Let's just say that. but, you know, many friends and family state that when you explain a project, an art project that you wanna work on or that you have in mind, they say they usually have. No idea what you're talking about. Do you feel misunderstood or are you used to people needing further details and visuals to [00:13:00] understand the magic

that is happening inside your, your cranium?

Chris: that's a great question. I am extremely used to being misunderstood. I've been, I've been with my wife for a long time. Um, we met, we met as teenagers and

she's been trying to understand what's going on in my mind that entire time. So I

Paddy: you like Kimmy? Yeah, me too.

Chris: Yeah, totally. And I think, Having that initial person to bounce these ideas off far before they get to anyone else is super helpful because she doesn't get it.

I can truly understand that most people aren't gonna get it, but to your point, I've found the individuals that need less explanation and going back to what I just said about that turn, where reaction is, is moving through you, intuition, all of these things are becoming present because that's that trust in myself, that [00:14:00] trust in my creative process, that trust in these ideas.

And I've surrounded myself with very creative individuals, creative athletes, all these people that make my ideas a little less crazy essentially.

Paddy: Do you feel like it's like it all makes sense in your brain and then you're like telling Kimmy or one of your pals or you know, colleagues, you're like, okay, I've got this idea, and then it comes out and instead of like A, B, C, D, it's like a Q lamp elbow

also. Oh, look at that thing over there. Like it something about like it all makes sense kind of swirling around in your brain, but then when you have to filter it through one thing, your mouth,

it's like, oh maybe I need to like write out an outline here

is that how the process is with

Chris: The process. But it, the worst part is for an artist, you would think, I can't even draw the outline. Or it's like a, it's an evolving, continuing thing, but yeah, it does not it's not like a puzzle fitting together in my brain either. [00:15:00] it's an understanding of myself, an understanding of, here we go, we're gonna probably get heady pretty quick here, but it's just, it's that, trust that.

I have been given this gift. However, we get gifts in this world to be an artist and let these ideas and these concepts flow through me. And ultimately, I'm just a medium and I don't own these ideas. They're not all mine. They come from the people I meet, the conversations I have, the subconscious mind they come from.

If you wanna go to the heady realm of just like on a cellular level of my grandparents being artists and, and those types of things. And beyond and beyond and beyond, it's like everything that shaped me as a human is continually present in my art and in my creative process. And so if you look at a, the film I just made on a surface level.

Great. It's skiing, it's snowboarding, it's surfing, it's all these things I love. But then

I dive super deep into mycology and red light and the cycle of life [00:16:00] and water cycle and the seasons and the natural world, and how light moves across landscapes and all of these concepts that have ultimately shaped my perspective on this human existence and just our, our consciousness as a human race and expanding that consciousness and exploring deeper and deeper.

So to your question yet again, it's, I don't know what's going on in my head nor, which is probably why I can't explain it very well. You know, I just have to accept that I don't know and be grateful that my head puts those pieces together eventually, and however I'm translating that throughout the process.

Makes sense to someone along the way because then we wouldn't succeed otherwise, I guess.

Paddy: well, let's talk about that process because you've said that you can't spell painting without pain, and now that seems opposed to skiing because to me, skiing is this like very joy filled, uh, activity. So is that why you ski?

Because [00:17:00] art is painful and

Chris: you ever wore ski boots?

Paddy: Yeah.

There's, there's, there's a couple, uh, Taylor's bunions probably out there who are screaming at me,

Chris: yeah. No. No. Uh, I think art is joy as well, but the depth of painting and art, like the actual content and the things that. When you walk into a house, a museum, whatever it is, I don't know if you've had this experience. I've had it many times. A, a painting for whatever reason, resonates with you, speaks to your soul on a deeper level.

It gives you a feeling, it gives you emotion. It gives you all of these things.

And I think it's personally, it's triggering a moment in time, a past experience. It's like you look at something abstract and everybody sees something different. Everybody feels something different. So trying to [00:18:00] explain what an artist was intending or meaning or painting is useless in my mind because it's, it's for the viewer to have that feeling.

And so skiing equally gives me that feeling of expressing myself in these mountains in a way that no one has. Done before. Yes. There's skiers for, for centuries. I don't know how old skiing is. Very old. Um, there's been skiers,

yeah, skiers for centuries. Developing, progressing. We have the Shane McConkey of the world testing rocker and all of these things that came before me.

But until I put my influence and my ideas of how to express that, I'm the first to do it in that exact way. And that's the beautiful thing that with art, with skiing, with all of these mediums, nothing can be replicated these are fleeting moments in time.

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Paddy: Say, you know, I am feeling x. I need to go ski,

or I am feeling y, so I need to [00:19:00] go paint. How do you differentiate where to go? How do you know that you need to be in the mountains? How do you know that you need to be in the art studio?

Chris: I don't differentiate, I think both are a pull as an artist, 'cause I view them both as an art form. So it really comes down to availability and time. My studio's in my home.

Paddy: Yeah.

Chris: And so if I have kids and things happening, I can just walk downstairs and pick up a paintbrush. Skiing takes a bit more of a plan and conditions are dependent in a lot of things.

So I would say in that sense, I'm much more of a painter and a drawer and a watercolors or whatever it, like I travel with sketchbooks and all of these things, so that is a daily practice. And skiing, I obviously can't practice daily, especially now with children and

Paddy: Yes.

Chris: things. So in a, in a past life, sure, the, the pull to go skiing was greater, then drawing in my sketchbook.

Like I started with the sketchbook as a kid, [00:20:00] drawing on every piece of homework, every textbook. 'cause I couldn't pay attention in school. And I was, I was not cut out for the academic world. And so my,

Paddy: in the margins of my notebooks is what got me through math class.

Chris: 100% and a few friends that helped me along the way. Um, but yes, I'm, I'm with you there. And I, then took all of that energy and creativity into skiing for a very long time.

And then once the opportunity came to create skis and merge those two worlds together in a very meaningful and intentional way, that's kind of when I, I had this realization like, oh, wow, there's an opportunity here where me doodling on my sketchbook still out in the mountains or on the airplane or

Paddy: Yeah.

Chris: is something that's use a useful, a, a good use of my time, essentially.

Paddy: Is there any difference in your mind, in your life between art [00:21:00] and movement?

Chris: Yes. Yes. The difference would be. Movement also is strategic to keep a healthy life. The way I move skiing or climbing or surfing there's no difference. But we need movement in our bodies in ways that I wouldn't consider artistic. Like I used to road bike a lot to keep myself fit.

I used to go on a trail run, which is not necessarily my cup of tea, or I would, there's certain things that movement are necessary to keep the body healthy and keep everything working with all the injuries. So in that respect, they're different. But a vast majority of the sports I do, I view as art.

Paddy: I guess what I mean here is like athletes, especially professional athletes, train their bodies.

sometimes daily, you know, year round.

Chris: Mm-hmm.

Paddy: Do you think that creativity can be trained the same way, or does it re require like a completely different type of exercise?

Chris: That's a great [00:22:00] way to ask it. I think creativity can be trained daily because that presence and just constantly letting things flow through you is when something great will happen. And the same can be said for training your body. You'll feel monotonous at times, but you'll make those breakthroughs.

And with art specifically, you never know when that magical moment's gonna come. Like, I, I have hundreds and hundreds of paintings. And not to say that they're all worth everyone seeing because they're not. I've used musicians as an example a lot too, like songwriting. many, many of my favorite musicians that talk about when they wrote a song, it came through them in, in a matter of minutes or an hour. But it was that. It was what you're saying.

It was that repetition of writing every day and their ideas and all of these things. And then that moment happens. And so the same could be said for the body.

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Paddy: Well, as an athlete, your story seems to be really driven by [00:23:00] intuition and feel

versus strict discipline and repetition. Is that freeform athletic instinct something that you consciously developed, or do you think it's more of a muscle that you worked out? In your art studio, and then one day Blemo, you were like, oh, this is also present in my skiing.

Chris: I guess I haven't consciously thought of that, but I, I would say it's, it's more of a realization than an intentional thing into, to your question, yes, you're a hundred percent right. It's all intuition and feel,

It was just realizing that it's present in both and maybe this conversation is the first time I'm even realizing it.

'cause it, it really takes the, it really takes the time to reflect on why you do something. 'cause I don't a, I don't often ask myself, why am I painting right now? Why am I skiing right now? I just have that pull and that instinct and that's what I like doing. And so I keep doing it

Paddy: well, I think it's pretty clear that there's, there's, no part of you. It's like, well, here's where the skiing [00:24:00] stops in the art, you know, or the artist begins, and so when you're in the art studio, you're a skier in the art studio.

When you're in the mountain, you're an artist

And I think people who obsess over, you know, tricks and style communion with nature, understand what you mean about, you know, skiing being this artistic expression. But I think there's probably a lot of skiers who see it strictly as a physical

activity. There's probably a lot of skiers listening who don't really see skiing in artistic terms. So for those folks,

can you explain it to them? How does making turns down a hill become a form of expression and artistic realization?

Chris: I don't know that I can explain it to them necessarily because they, their experience is their experience. So I'll take McKayla Schiffrin as an example.

She has clearly done something that no other human has been able to [00:25:00] do.

Paddy: The goat.

Chris: wildly impressive and

unbelievable. But she is such a machine and she is so trained to my understanding, this, this should be fact checked.

But she doesn't go skiing for fun. She doesn't take free runs. she is like trained all the time to get the best result. And her, she has people in her life, coaches being like, oh, you're looking off, we're done for today, or, oh, you're this, we're done. You know? So it's

Paddy: She has said there is no such thing as like a turn where she's not analyzing it herself.

She's always, even if she's like, you know, side slipping back down to the car,

at the end of the day, she is always working on some level of top tier performance. It's why she has stood on top of so many goddamn podiums in her

life.

You know?

Chris: And this isn't to like negate anything 'cause she is clearly unbelievable. But if I was trying to explain to her

why I ski versus why she [00:26:00] skis, don't know if it's gonna translate. Because if we just have different views on why we're skiing and I think it would be really hard for someone that views skiing as, a physical act that is.

You're working towards a goal of perfection. Like my art is so far from perfection and my skiing is so far from perfection. The imperfections of those two things are what drive me and what get me excited. And the nuances between those turns and between those paint strokes and the actual artistry of it all.

Now I can't not want. You to get into Lycra and spend a day with McKayla and then McKayla, get into some baggy like free ride kit and spend

Paddy: a day with you in the backcountry. Dear outside TV producers, please make this dream

come

Chris: You heard it here first. Folks, Mikayla Schiffrin is [00:27:00] going to retire and nose butter in powder.

I, I will take her happily and I would run a race course with her

Paddy: gonna be, this is make it happen.

TV producers out there make this, make this dream a reality.

Chris: yeah. No, no. It would be incredible to take her heli skiing. I think she would probably find extreme joy in riding powder on fat skis. And maybe I, this she, here's the thing. I could have just said this on a podcast and I could be so wrong.

She could go free skiing all the time and I'm just

Paddy: she just keeps it under the

Chris: Yeah, exactly. She's just like a closet closet power skier. Yeah.

Paddy: a buff up to here.

Chris: Maybe she is candied. You know, who knows? Like. is very talented on skis. It's, it's possible we're looking at the same

Paddy: really know what candy it looks like? No, I don't think so.

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Here is your opportunity to get the headiest you want to get in this conversation. Go full Grateful [00:28:00] Dead on me right now.

Chris: Okay.

Paddy: Dolores La Chappelle, the trailblazing powder skier, an ecologist who I am fascinated with and absolutely love had this wonderful way of describing skiing.

She said, the best turns are when you surrender to nature, when thought is removed in and you're unconsciously moving in union with the snow and the terrain. She called it the fullness of the void, the nothingness state.

Is that what you feel when you're skiing and is it also the same thing that you're after in the art studio?

Chris: I think she described it much better than I would ever be able to. So for me to get heady, that's, uh, yeah. how, How should I add value to something that brilliant. Um,

I think my existence, my skiing, my art, all of it is a manifestation, if you will.

And that manifestation is simply [00:29:00] aligning your internal compass with your external actions, if that

Paddy: Oh, oh, I love

Chris: we do it? Did. Is Dolores approved? I actually don't know this woman, so I, yeah.

Paddy: dude, that was pretty frigging heady, so

Chris: there we go.

You're welcome.

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PADDYO VO:

There'll be more opportunity to get waaay out there with artist and skier Chris Benchetler after the break

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Paddy: let's go from the ethereal and ineffable, the magic stardust

land, and let's pull it into the actual

Chris: Okay.

Paddy: mountains of the moon.

Watching this film was kind of like when I went to Meow Wolf in Santa Fe, like this neon glow, the dark onslaught

of your senses.

Not in an uncomfortable way, but pleasantly consuming.

It is so stunning and captivating and in terms of like the realm of action sports films, [00:30:00] it's so unique. So first, thank you very much for making it. Secondly, what the hell man? How the hell did you dream this wild thing up?

Chris: Thank you very much for the kind words, the, how I made it, I'll get to that.

But the, ability to paint these landscapes and try to recreate the paintings that I'm creating in my studio, in the natural world,

highlight the natural world,

highlight mycology it goes so many layers deep into who I am.

We could go as far back as starting with the dead or we could go starting with mycology. Um, so I'm trying, I'm trying to, I don't know how much time we have here. Um, basically,

Paddy: As long as you want,

Chris: yeah, I mean we will, I'll let you ask questions, but essentially mycology, we'll just use that as an example because Paul Stamets narrates the film who is a brilliant, brilliant mycologist. When I started writing my concepts. Or even [00:31:00] backtrack further, I had a lot of head injuries.

and I got one riding a mountain bike through the BC bike race that was like day four on Vancouver Island, somewhere hit my head, cracked my helmet, and around that time this was, well over a decade, and I was having noticeable change in my personality where Kimmy was getting equally frustrated and nervous maybe with how much I would forget things. And so I just started going down the rabbit hole basically. I went and saw a neurologist, got some testing, failed some testing, talked about the Western route of taking medicine and doing the things, and then.

I'm not that type of person per se. So I started researching mushrooms and I found ts. Um, so I went on a deep dive into Paul's Stamets and so fast forwarding now to this film,

I wanted my cology to be a character in this film, or mushrooms to be a character in this film. To draw, attention to how mycelium connects all living things and how we've essentially

evolved from mushrooms and [00:32:00] mycelium. And it's related to the Big Bang Theory, which is the avalanche scene as supposed to represent the Big Bang. There's like a lot of. Science in the film if you really listen to what Paul's saying.

That is one of a million stories as to like what mountains of the moon. Represents to me it's just, it's so much deeper than just a, a film.

It's, it is, it is an extension of me. It's a piece of art, and I will stop talking so you can ask questions about the dead and the sports and the light and all the things. It's just, it is a very abstract art project that

Paddy: Oh, for sure.

Chris: is extremely hard to describe to, especially to people that have never really looked into ology and people that don't really resonate with the dead.

If you don't, if you don't care about those two things on a surface level, you might think this film is wackadoodle.

Paddy: I disagree with you

because I'm kind of like a casual, dead fan. it's like, oh, like, oh, the [00:33:00] Jerry Garcia band. Like, I really like that one album. And like, oh, the Dead is on. Like, that's cool. And we go down the. Path of jam bands, like, you're gonna Lose Me. You

know, like, if this, film featured Phish, we probably wouldn't be talking honestly.

But, but I think, like, you know, I obviously am a skier. I love, all things outdoors. I love art. And I think it spoke to me on that level. And the mycelium stuff was like, oh wow, this is really, interesting to me, I'm not completely aware of this

stuff and I think that there's probably a lot of listeners that aren't.

So I think it's worth pointing out that mountains of the Moon is like much more than a series of just like rad skiing and surfing and climbing and mountain biking sessions with glow in the dark Woo ha all

over the place. Like, it really is exploring how we. And our community and our sensory experiences, uh, as individuals and members of that community are all connected.

Nature is living in us and through [00:34:00] us, and that is really cool.

And a lot of that is done through, like you said, Paul's narration and the visuals of mycelium. So can you explain what that network is? What the, am I saying this correctly? My chorizo. My Corel.

Chris: Yeah.

The to pronunciation, I'm the wrong person to, ' even fungi versus fungi, there's multiple ways to say it. You did what? Good enough for me, but the connection,

it's basically the world's natural internet. Paul's put out his hands and he said, and this much mycelium from fingertip to fingertip. gotta say there's a million different neuro connections and how trees are communicating and when mushrooms pop up to receive water and like they've found mycelium and these networks under the ocean, they've found it in space.

I think the oldest living mushroom is billions of years old. Everything is so interconnected you can [00:35:00] refer to it as God, I grew up Catholic.

I have certain beliefs and faith in all of these things, and so you can call it the universe, you can call it all of these things. But ultimately that universal consciousness and connection all in my mind ties back to mushrooms and mycelium.

Paddy: My understanding, and tell me if I'm correct here, and maybe this is like a great way to, simply question mark, explain it to the listeners, is that like this mycelium network is essentially the phone lines of the living world and it's how the entire Earth talks to one another slash itself. Am I correct?

Chris: From my understanding, yes. It, see, we should have just asked you the question 'cause you did a great job. That was, that was perfect. Perfect way to say it.

Paddy: think a part, my job is to like, take big things and hopefully try to distill them

Chris: Consider it distilled you nailed it.

Paddy: Okay. Cool. Yes. All right. I earned my, uh, gold star, uh, for today.

[00:36:00] PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

When working on mountains of the moon. Were you trying to show the audience that Yeah, all these things are connected.

We also, in our experiences outdoors within this

network, connected not just to the network, but also to one another.

Chris: A hundred percent. what I hope to accomplish for those of that have seen the film is to take people on a journey, a spiritual journey as well, we start at sunset in the film, we have the whole avalanche sequence, which is to represent the Big Bang and the creation of all living things. That takes us into the darkness. The darkness is where we live for a majority of the film, and that darkness is now taking light as, my paintbrush and sculpting the land with light. So highlighting contrast and colors and textures. And the snow segment, as you saw, was very drawn out, very slow music, very intentional to [00:37:00] really make you feel like we were painting these landscapes. And then climbing is. Supposed to represent ancient wisdom and the creation of rocks are some of the oldest living things on the planet.

And then we go into mountain biking, which I wanted to go to the old growth forest because that is where mycelium is most known and present in living under the soil floor. And as you said, communicating with the rest of the world, and then we go into, from bike into Mickey's whole segment, which I have to give my flowers to Mickey Hart. He's been incredible on this journey. And he live, he live scored that whole section. I don't know if you know that, but he like took, took that section into his studio and live scored that.

So that is the only track that isn't a grateful dead track because he actually made that just for this film, which is

Paddy: drummer for the Grateful Dead, like doing his own incredible percussion set.

Chris: Mm-hmm. So my hope was to have drums be a culmination of all the sports, all the [00:38:00] seasons, all the things combining into one.

And drums in space for those like yourself that maybe don't know the dead that well is like a section in every Grateful Dead show where Mickey takes people on this journey. so when we get into space, that is where Kimmy Swimmy, Kimmy Werner pops in. And that's, I wanted to go with jellyfish.

They seem extremely alien to me. They

Paddy: Yes.

Chris: like the mushrooms of the sea. They seem like something that I don't truly understand. And they also absorb light and do really cool things. at night underwater. And so there was all these different concepts and ideas and I couldn't figure out how to get us to space, so we went underwater.

So, so we went, we went and sw

Paddy: have the budge for

Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah. NASA wasn't on the table. Um, so we went underwater, which was incredible. And then we come out of that, into our farthest reaches into to another planet, let's say, where Rob is surfing on another planet. So we're the [00:39:00] far, uh, farthest away on our journey. We wanted it to make it feel like we came out of space to this other planet before we come back to reality and back to earth.

And that's why the sky in the back of Rob's was, doctored. And I guess I get this asked a lot, so I should say it now. The whole film was to be the antithesis of AI and

Paddy: Yeah, yeah,

Chris: in camera, everything created as a piece of art and everything, to the best of our ability be real.

And like those, there's these gobo shots with my projections of artwork. We had lasers out in the field. We had Jeff Wright, one of our filmers, made this incredibly cool filter that if you saw like all the, in the drum section, all like the little mini steal your faces. And we would take our headlamp off and it would look like we were re remo steal your face right off your head, which is a song lyric.

Um, so we had all of these amazing

Paddy: were all practical.

Chris: all practical in camera. He [00:40:00] like used. Yeah, it was insane. He was using Christmas lights out there And in the fire scene you can see all the little dancing bears that's just a filter in front of his lens. And that's all the, yeah, that's all the flames and stuff.

So that was, none of, that was after the fact. None of it was visual

Paddy: Christopher Nolan ski film artwork. You're blowing my mind,

Chris: Wolfs, if you're gonna put me in that realm, thank you so much. ,

PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

Paddy: Conceptually, this seems like a logistical nightmare to produce, like this beautiful thing that you have made is. Wildly audacious and like no one will confirm the actual budget for this film. I have to imagine a, a lot of money and time and brain power and creative power went into it because it's like things like the iridescent skeleton suits they took six months longer to create than expected. Like you also shot at night, sometimes very deep [00:41:00] in the backcountry hauling lights and laser rigs, generators plus oodles of camera equipment shooting.

This seems like an immense lift, but was there one specific day or location that stands out as the most difficult?

Chris: Yes. I'd say logistically, Mike Wiley's heli The temperatures were minus 20. We were out all night. It was in January, pretty far north. You're a blue river

18 hours we were out there the helis can't fly other than National Guard, and some military hells, hells don't fly at night.

So we couldn't get support if my broken hip, which we could go back to was not doing so well. Um, if we got really hurt, we had to be stabilized in a tent. The same genius that made the suits, Shane, fabricated these insane diesel heaters for the tents and stuff just to keep us warm 'cause it was so freezing.

And to also [00:42:00] charge the batteries, keep the batteries warm, do all the, like the logistics and wigglys was absolutely mind, blowingly difficult. And then because there's no helicopters, were accessing everything by foot. And so base camp to the top of the mountain is a multiple hour skin. And you're talking about skinning lights stands and generators and all of these things.

Like logistically, Wigglys was insane,

Paddy: I mean, it looks it's gorgeous. It turns out and you're like, thank God we did this. Of course

you don't know that going into it, so how in the hell did you sit down and plan this thing? Think like, I, I don't know. This all seems pretty reasonable.

We can definitely do this. Like how is there never a point where you or someone else in production were like,

Chris, I love your, I love your big, beautiful brain

and your art, but holy shit man. Like, I don't know if my

quads can handle this. I

think my feet are gonna like,, fall off or turn to ice cubes.

Chris: You're, you're nailing what every single person said. I would basically, [00:43:00] I was basically told that Wigglys wasn't gonna happen because No, everyone was doubting me.

I'm sitting at home putting all of my time and energy and manifestation into this thing, and I'm like, you guys, we have support from a heli operation.

We have support from Alterra slash Icon who owns Wigglys and Mammoth, and they're telling us they have availability during this time. There's no guarantee for snow. There's all of these things working against us like. I have a broken hip, I'm not gonna be able to ski that. Well, there's all, everything was working against us and every single person was becoming so negative to your point, like, this isn't gonna work.

This is fucking crazy.

Paddy: Would

Chris: blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Paddy: or rational?

Chris: They're being rational. Yes. And that, and so at a point I was like, alright, we're not going. It's off the table. Like I actually was the first time I [00:44:00] folded and I was just like, if you guys are gonna be this rational,

Paddy: Yeah.

Chris: Um, I'm, I'm out. I'm out.

We're not, we're not doing it. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And then they were like, oh, wait, wait, wait. No, we shouldn't do that. And then so they, after that no one said anything to me anymore because I actually got to my tipping point

Paddy: yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris: Worked out because we put so much energy and thought into every single layer.

And then obviously Wigglys came forward in a massive way with their guides and their staff and their protocol and safety and all that stuff. So unbelievable.

Paddy: You know, I think it's been described by people who are on the shoot, as like the most high functioning shit show that they've ever been a part of or something.

Or just,

yeah,

Chris: That's my existence.

Paddy: Yeah,

Chris: Just a high functioning shit. Show you, you get Kimmy to say those exact words when you interviewed her. She might have, she might have shared that.

[00:45:00] PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

Paddy: Action sports films or just mountain sports films in general to me can be pretty rote. , And therefore pretty boring. I, I feel like you tend to see the same kind of segments, the same kind of cinematography and hear the same kind of music. there's not a lot of folks to me, I think in that realm of filmmaking who are taking a lot of chances or being that bold, this is an outlier. This is completely different. How much of that was on your mind when planning the film, when shooting the film? Like, we gotta be different.

And so we gotta kind of push it, , not just creatively, but also, physically

Chris: Can't spell painting without pain.

Paddy: There you go.

Chris: Uh,

Paddy: That's right.

Chris: we go. Uh, I think. it was very present on my mind because I think I am an out there thinker and person and very bold in how I [00:46:00] approach all of it. And so it was to be as truthful and honest of a representation of me and my ideas as I could possibly make without sacrificing or without giving in to the logic.

What did we say? What did we say before? The rational? Yeah, without, without giving into the rationality it just, it is so ambitious and is so audacious and it just such a like. Impossible task to bring that many creative individuals together. I mean, I think throughout the process of this, I, I probably hired over a hundred people there's just so many layers to this project that are almost impossible to put into words that I think to your point, it, it was my intention to create a very honest representation of who I am.

And it turns out I'm a very, uh, complicated person. So.

I don't think you're truly making art if you're playing it safe. And I have not said this as well as [00:47:00] the millions of people that have said it before me. I think David Bowie has a great quote about wading out into water until your feet are no longer touching, and that's when you'll make a breakthrough.

Or I've

Paddy: hmm.

Chris: heard, the Rick Rubins or the Neil Youngs talk about stepping into that unknown void or stepping off the ledge and actually just to actually do that as an artist is so terrifying because you, you risk everything, your financial security, your everything. And my poor wife has suffered that tremendously with me.

And so her support is, undoubtedly the only reason I've succeeded. ' it, I've taken so much risk on these ideas and myself, but would it have the same feeling to you if I didn't? And I don't know that it would, but the idea of just stepping into that unknown and knowing that I pushed everything to see what I'm.

capable of creating as an artist. that is the thing that, gives me life.

Paddy: [00:48:00] Is that the secret sauce then is in your skiing in your art, it's always push into that state of nothingness and then never, ever forget to give high praise to your incredibly supportive wife.

Chris: Nailed it. Yeah. Yet again, yes, I, I think, I think that pretty much sums it up,

MUSIC IN THE CLEAR FOR A BEAT

Paddy: it is now time for the final ramble. One piece of gear you cannot live without.

Chris: Let's call it a pen or a pencil.

Paddy: Yes. No one said that. Boom. Again. Unique. Unique, okay. Best outdoor snack.

Chris: That's, uh, that's a tough question. I was, I was gonna choose just a quick, quick banana 'cause I seem to love bananas, but they, they don't travel well in backpacks. They always bruise. So that was, that's why I like,

Paddy: crosses the threshold of

a door, it's fully bruised.

Chris: yeah. No, no, I was gonna say banana and peanut butter is [00:49:00] like my favorite snack anytime.

But mountain snack, we'll just go with trail mix.

Paddy: I'm so, I am surprised you didn't say mushrooms, to be honest.

Chris: That's fair. This is totally fair.

Paddy: What is your hottest outdoor hot? Take

Chris: since we talked about it here, that artists should be less fearful to step into the unknown.

Paddy: Okay. I

Chris: There's a lot of, there's a lot of them out there

Paddy: I feel like we s.

Chris: a leap.

Paddy: I feel like we started heady and we're ending heady, and we

got heady in the middle, and now we just have this nice heady sandwich.

Chris: There we go.

Paddy: Maybe that's the best outdoor snack.

 MUSIC IN THE CLEAR FOR A BEAT

PADDYO VO:

Chris Benchetler is a professional skier, an artist, and an award winning filmmaker. You can keep up with his skiing, creativity, and film updates on Instagram at Chris Benchetler. And I highly [00:50:00] recommend checking out his YouTube channel, at Benchetler Films, for behind the scenes shorts on how he do what he do. They're fascinating to watch. But of course, I'm sure you're wondering where you can watch his brand new film Mountains of the Moon.

It is still screening in select theaters right now and  will be released on streaming platforms in the Spring. Find a theater near you and stay up to date on streaming info at Chris Benchetler dot com.

I cannot more highly recommend that you  watch Mountains Of The Moon and let your mind and heart explode in neon delight. You'll thank me later.

And don't forget, the podcast is on Youtube.  Give your eyes an ear buffet of story. Check out the video episodes of the show at Outside Podcast 1 on YouTube.

And, remember that we want to hear from you. Sooo, email your pod [00:51:00] reactions, guest nominations, what glow in the dark sport you want to do next -- my votes for roller derby, and whatever else you want to tell and/or ask us to Outside Podcast At Outside Inc Dot Com.

The Outside Podcast is hosted and produced by me, Paddy O'Connell. But you can call me PaddyO. The show is also produced by the storytelling wizard, Micah "if you count the smiley face I make on my chest everytime I schmear sunscreen on, then I too am an artist" Abrams. Music and Sound Design by Robbie Carver. Booking and research by Jeanette Courts, with additional production support by Maren Larsen.

The Outside Podcast is made possible by our Outside Plus members. Learn about all the extra rad benefits and become a member yourself at Outside Online Dot Com Slash Pod Plus.